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-   -   SNS update: I think I know which 4 of the 6 eggs we are supposed to get (https://www.therwp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1287)

Ratabulous 19th February 2005 02:27 AM

SnS: Defunked
 
Honestly, you guys can get the craziest ideas! if Rare had meant for SnS to be something big and long-term, they would have had Mumbo or Gruntilda say something about it, wouldn't they? I believe that the locations of the eggs are not coincidences, and that the four-egg thing was the original intention, but the interview was a Chaos Theory. Something to make you go, "Oh, alright, that's how it happened." I'm almost positive that SnS is either in BK or not at all. anyway, has anyone tried getting the blue and pink eggs + ice key in the order of the cutscenes at the end, and then maybe something would happen? Notice how Mumbo only shows you two of the six eggs, and the ice key of course. Plus, the locations they were in were always significant. I can remember when I was younger, I used to look in at Wozza's cave and yearn to get the ice key. I never could find a way. I also remember flying out to sharkfood island and wondering, why was it there? I also remember trying to open the door in Gobi's valley. Like I said, if Rare still had SnS accessible, it would have been more obvious. The other eggs may have served some other purpose, but until I saw the supposed "Screens" of BT in BK, I had no idea there were eggs. Plus, I remember seeing a picture of BK with the secrets (blue egg, pink egg, ice key) but nothing more. Plus, when Mumbo talks to ylou,after you beat BK, he says that these are the secrets you missed. He says nothing about the other four eggs. Could someone try just getting the secrets in the order they're shown, then beating the game to see if Mumbo says anything different? I believe it's the most plausible answer. Besides, after they cut-scene of Banjo on the beach with Blubber riding a racer, anything could have changed in the game. Could someone please try this? I already got the six eggs and key. The original game pak would work best, not a ROM or something.

Banjo-Fella 19th February 2005 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ratabulous
I'm almost positive that SnS is either in BK or not at all.

Well, er, it has to be one of those. ;)

Actually, I've just thought of something. Seeing as there was originally a Stop 'N' Swap planned with DK64, maybe the blue and pink eggs and the ice key were the only items ever meant to be used in Banjo-Tooie? Maybe the rest were meant to be swapped into DK64, and maybe some others into Conker's Bad Fur Day? There was an extra level in the windmill at one point, but it was removed in a comic fashion, so there are places they could have put in such a connection.

SubDrag 19th February 2005 02:10 PM

The RWP Official theory, and on our SNS special, is that the ice key was intended for DK. The rest of the eggs, presumably, then were intended for BT, though the only one given any functionality at one point was probably the ice key.

Ratabulous 19th February 2005 04:57 PM

Yes, your logic is undebatable because BK was made before DK64 or BT, but still, do you think that it's worth a shot winning the game with only the Blue and Pink eggs and the Ice Key to see if Mumbo says anything different? I mean, the only reason he talks to Banjo at the end is because you missed some secrets. If you collected those secrets, don't you suppose he would do something different, or not at all?

Ratabulous

SubDrag 19th February 2005 05:09 PM

It's almost surely been done before, and we haven't seen any evidence of additional text or anything.

Actually, BK and DK were in development at the same time, and SNS was likely tested at one point between them with the ice key. BT was later of course, which makes our theory make more sense as well.

Slasher 19th February 2005 05:18 PM

Wouldn't that mean people should concentrate more on Donkey Kong for a while to see if anything is still on that side?

DarkAriesknight 19th February 2005 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ratabulous
Yes, your logic is undebatable because BK was made before DK64 or BT, but still, do you think that it's worth a shot winning the game with only the Blue and Pink eggs and the Ice Key to see if Mumbo says anything different? I mean, the only reason he talks to Banjo at the end is because you missed some secrets. If you collected those secrets, don't you suppose he would do something different, or not at all?

Ratabulous

Hey. That hasn't been tried yet or has it? I'll try it. I'm trying to get 100% on my N64 right now. And I have a question. When you beat the game when you want to play again do you have to beat grunty again or does everybody thank you and you follow your sister or something? Just curious cuz that could help in some ways...

SubDrag 19th February 2005 05:33 PM

You're right, we should try to concentrate on DK. We hacked the image and warp mod, the text mod has been ever so elusive still to this day. There's probably more to DK than we've found.

Slasher 19th February 2005 05:36 PM

I'd help with the hacking too, but I lost my gameshark years back when someone at a party tried to hook my regular games shark ontop of my gameshark pro, and then it stopped working. Also I don't know how to hack that well, I only know a small tidbit.

sambkman 19th February 2005 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ratabulous
Yes, your logic is undebatable because BK was made before DK64 or BT, but still, do you think that it's worth a shot winning the game with only the Blue and Pink eggs and the Ice Key to see if Mumbo says anything different? I mean, the only reason he talks to Banjo at the end is because you missed some secrets. If you collected those secrets, don't you suppose he would do something different, or not at all?

Ratabulous

I tried that. NOthing new.

DarkAriesknight 19th February 2005 05:48 PM

All I can do is open up hex code in roms and look for every bit of text and use a grpahics changing program to look at all the sprites. Hey. has anybody looked at all text related to SnS?

Ratabulous 19th February 2005 06:58 PM

SnS
 
Well then, if it's been tried I can hardly argue with that. Say, Subdrag, was anything funny going on at Rare during the making of DK64? What about BT? Did they use the same designers? Perhaps the team that created SnS were fired/quit and the new team tried getting rid of it as quickly as possible? Sometimes it blows my mind that SnS didn't fully come to life. It all sounds so fun and mysterious. I have a question. Before you enter the code that allows you to get the egg on Nabnut's table, is it possible to enter his den during winter and see him sleeping with a friend? because I don't remember being able to get into Nabnut's house before I entered the Red Egg code. Just a thought. i mean hey, you can't enter three other locations where eggs are, why not nabnut's egg?

Ratabulous. Angrily Happy :mad: :)

sambkman 19th February 2005 07:09 PM

It's a yellow egg and you CAN get in his house during the winter before. Just break the Window.

Ratabulous 19th February 2005 07:10 PM

purple
 
thanx

Ratabulous

SubDrag 19th February 2005 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkAriesknight
All I can do is open up hex code in roms and look for every bit of text and use a grpahics changing program to look at all the sprites. Hey. has anybody looked at all text related to SnS?

You forget N64 ROMs aren't simple like earlier systems, the text is compressed.

DarkAriesknight 19th February 2005 07:51 PM

I have an idea. We are always looking inside the game such as gameplay,coding and such. maybe the secret to Sns is somehwere else such as in the jumper/expansion pack? rumble pack,memeroy card. many other things can be check. I'm just thining outside the box here. if it were to be outside the game we have lots to still check.

Jason 19th February 2005 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkAriesknight
I have an idea. We are always looking inside the game such as gameplay,coding and such. maybe the secret to Sns is somehwere else such as in the jumper/expansion pack? rumble pack,memeroy card. many other things can be check. I'm just thining outside the box here. if it were to be outside the game we have lots to still check.

It wouldn't be outside of the game.

Zeanith 19th February 2005 07:54 PM

He's right.
It wouldn't.

hatrickpatrick 20th February 2005 12:53 PM

you know, the EQ has a memory card manager
it would be possible to rip BK's saved memory onto the memory card, then dump it in BT...
But most likely it would just **** up BT, and I'd say it's been tried before...

Klungo 20th February 2005 01:22 PM

What is an EQ?

Benjo Koolzooie 20th February 2005 05:38 PM

Hatrick, are you in the UK/Ireland? I have an Equalizer I want to sell.

hatrickpatrick 20th February 2005 06:13 PM

Cool! Yeah I live in Dublin (in Ireland >_>).
Eh
Do you have an ebay seller account? We could do it in a private auction or something, and you list it as "buy it now"
Incidentally, how much are u charging for it?

Benjo Koolzooie 20th February 2005 06:29 PM

I have sent you a private messege Hatrick.

Don't forget to reply to me!!

Also, no comments on the pointless "Big Clucker" cut scenes yet? Does nobody else find these strange??

R Hunter 21st February 2005 08:57 AM

You have a point Benjo, Rare could've easily just did the same thing for them as they did with those green dudes in clanker's cavern (can't remember the name). I dunno maybe there's more in CCW then we know so far.

Shadow the h. 22nd February 2005 06:39 PM

I tried that stop n swop trick but the door was still closed.
Maybe you guys have dreamed that all because it happens nothing by collecting the eggs and after the game of grunty.
So I give you my way first I remove the secrets than I collected the four eggs.
Pink Blue Cyan and Red. After that I wapred me to the game grunty was telling questions then I float to the exit go up the stairs then I used the code to change doors to pass the 800 notedoor after that I was in the room with the knockerdoors but it happens nothing have I collected maybe all notes and jiggy first is something wrong or was it a pathetic joke again like Club Joe I mean the pics of the door can create where Klungo comes in and with a super photo program you cancel Klungo so you see only the opened door.

Allright :) thats all

bye.

hatrickpatrick 23rd February 2005 12:28 PM

but
I think u have to get the icekey as well....

cyberen 23rd February 2005 10:12 PM

news flash:


Stop n' Swop is DEAD.

Banjo's Banjo 23rd February 2005 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bolt Dragoon, 2001
news flash:


Stop n' Swop is DEAD.

Fixed. Sort of. ;)

While I can say this search is probably a futile effort, I do have to say that at least this forum (the RWP in general) has benefited from a sudden burst in BK interest, whether in regards to SnS or not. The last few months have seen a huge growth in membership here, which is definitely a good thing.

So even if this research turns up nothing (which is likely, as I highly doubt that SnS in any real form is still accessable.), at least it resulted in conversation. :cool:

Benjo Koolzooie 24th February 2005 11:49 AM

I agree.

I doubt SnS still will be found in its working form. However, discussions about it are always interesting.

dmoss 24th February 2005 02:51 PM

Okay, I think that's all cool and everything, but could someone explain to me happened while I was gone? Where did all this hub-bub come up about needing only four SnS eggs? Have we found a way to connect the games or something? :eek:

Banjo-Fella 24th February 2005 03:21 PM

I severely doubt we'll find anything, but I find this fun all the same. It's all a bit nostalgic, really. ;)

Benjo Koolzooie 25th February 2005 10:38 AM

I think all eggs were needed to be honest.

hatrickpatrick 25th February 2005 10:43 AM

Quote:

Where did all this hub-bub come up about needing only four SnS eggs?
GTBG has a board in it which says that, and I for one seriously do think there's another cutscene in BK. If they left all this in, they MUST have left in the cutscene as well...

dmoss 25th February 2005 03:03 PM

Okay, thanks. I actually read the article explaining this last night, and understand that it was a fake. My bad...

Benjo Koolzooie 25th February 2005 04:35 PM

Oh yes..the board on GBTG, forgot about that.

What are the pictures on the board accompanying the 4 eggs and key??

Perhaps they just drew 4 eggs on for the sake? Perhaps 6 eggs on the board would have made it looked messy.

MarcX 25th February 2005 05:35 PM

Erm, excuse me, but in pc games... (expects everyone to stop reading now T_T) I've always been able to find all the text even if it was encrypted. You just find the decryption algorithm. Can someone explain to me why this is not possible here, or should I try and explain how it is possible on pc?

slaphappy 25th February 2005 07:56 PM

The text is compressed. It is like trying to extract the text from a zip file without knowing the decompression algorithm. Good luck.

Hakey Wake 25th February 2005 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo's Banjo
Fixed. Sort of. ;)

-laughs-

Those were the days. :D

MarcX 26th February 2005 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slaphappy
The text is compressed. It is like trying to extract the text from a zip file without knowing the decompression algorithm. Good luck.

It has to decompress it to print it on screen. While it's printing it on screen, you can search the memory for the text, breakpointmemory write it. When the text is no longer on screen, it will attempt to erase the text. You will end up in the function that erases the text no longer needed on screen. Where does it get it's pointer? How does it know what text to erase? If you trace back to where it's passed a pointer to the text, and then continue to backtrace far enough, you will find the place where this pointer is created, ie, the text is decompressed. Reverse this algorithm, and you know the decompression algorithm T_T

The most probably way of continuing from here is to 'decompress' the entire initialized data memory and then running a string searcher on it. Of course, all of the above requires you to be able to attach a debugger to the game. Is this possible on consoles? There has got to be equipment for that.

SubDrag 26th February 2005 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcX
Reverse this algorithm, and you know the decompression algorithm T_T

I don't think you realize the sheer difficulty in reverse engineering compression routines in assembly. It's hard enough to reverse engineer it in C...


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