You could basically just use the same routine.. without reversing it.

Just a thought:

What if the four eggs we're supposed to get are the four that aren't shown to us by Mumbo?

A different angle to view it at! However, Banjo speaks after collecting the pink egg, the ones with text following their collection are most likely ones that would be intended for SNS. (Although I am still not convinced, I think all were needed).

Banjo speaks whenever the first egg is collected, regardless of colour.

Oh my dear you have to learn a much here.

Is that certain?

If so, that further leads me to believe all the eggs were originally intended for collection.

Something is said after the pink egg is collected. What about the others? I am sure he says "Oh another one of those special eggs". He says two comments after collecting eggs, right?

One from collecting the pink and one from any of the others?

Someone confirm please.

Hmmmmm, i'm almost positive it's with any egg.

Though if I rememebr rightly the first egg I got was in fact, the pink one...

Yeah I got them in the order that mumbo showed me then as for the others I remember it like this:
Cyan
Green
Red
Yellow
If my memory's not completely gone Banjo made comments with the first two eggs I obtained then was quiet with the other 4. I honestly can't remember if he says anything for the Ice Key.

It's either him or Kazooie that says something about getting the Ice Key (Pretty sure it's Kazooie), either way there is text there.

Yes, it is Kazooie that says something about the Ice Key, something to the effect of "wow, a giant ice key, we should have this for later" .

What happened to the 'start debugging/reversing the game and find out' thing? I'm serious about this. Let's give it a shot! Can't we have a deep aim conversation about it?

What's that then?

I am not sure I know what that is.

T_T what, what is, exactly? Reversing stuff?

I've a few things to say, I havent been here in a few days and I want to reply to some of the confusion about the eggs themselves
First off, banjo speaks after the first 2 eggs, regardless of what order they are collected in.
Secondly, thats not a bad idea, we get the eggs mumbo doesnt mention... Can someone try that? It never made much sense that he only mentions 2 anyway, seeing as BT itself has the yellow as well....
Thridly, MarcX's idea is probably a good one, but I cant help feeling that if it WAS that simple it would have been tried already... We should have an AIM chat about it some time, it would be easier...

Yes, someone should try getting the items not revealed by Mumbo first.

You know, there are three game files. He comments on the first two eggs.

If you get two eggs on gamefile one, then two on gamefile two, then two on gamefile three, will they comment for all of them? Not saying it would be to any benefit, just curious.

Damn, I wish I had a cheat cart
I'm gonna buy one next week on ebay and try some of this out...

I thought about this for a while, here's what I came up with:

What on Earth would collecting 4 giant eggs have to do with melting an Ice Wall to get an Ice Key?

We know you get unlockables for the eggs and Dragon Kazooie for the Key in BT. But, what if it was originally meant for you to give the eggs to heggy to get dragon kazooie, take dragon kazooie back to BK and melt the door to the ice key, bring the ice key to BT, and get something really really rare?

Of course, I still believe Rare made SNS so they could use it at any time in any game in any way, They started to use it in Donkey Kong, canned it, and decided to use it in BT.

wouldn't BK need the image and fire support for dragon kazooie then? which we have no reason to think it has?

Yes it probably would need it.

I still wonder why Wozza isn't present on the photo mumbo shows? What explinations for this are there?

Hmm, never noticed that benjo
An interesting thing is that if you look at the ice wall after typing in the code, it still has glass fragments around the edges
Which implies that there is a cutscene of it being smashed...
A cutscene editor would really,really help us here, but it's damn impossible to find

Hmmm...

*scratches chin*

Intriguing...I never thought of anything like that; you guys are awesome... :cool:

Yes, and the ice panel that covers the door is in 2 halves if you use an image mod to change banjo in to one.

Havent any of you seen Gorilla Adventure.avi? :p

Yeah actually how did u do that? (where it's there one minute, gone the next)
Most image mods dont take effect unless you exit/ re enter the area...

Well, I've had a mini-theory about the whole Wozza's Cave thing. If you somehow manage to get into the cave before you get the jiggy from Wozza (something I don't think is possible normally), Wozza won't actually be in the cave. Well, maybe Banjo-Tooie was planned to interact with a lock-on cartridge which would stick between Banjo-Tooie & Banjo-Kazooie. Data such as Wozza's Cave could be loaded into Banjo-Tooie from Banjo-Kazooie's cart, and it could allow you to play there with Banjo-Tooie's physics. I thought at one point that you might be able to get Banjo in there, and use some fire eggs on the Ice Key door, or possibly use the egg aiming to aim an egg through the fire in Wozza's Cave, right at the icy slab blocking entrance to the Ice Key chamber...

that's possible... wasn't BT a 64DD game when it was first originally planned? DD or lock-on, either could work the same way...

Was it?

I always imagined (when I first saw the eggs and key secret ending), that the reason Wozza wasn't there is because he was supposed to have perhaps ran in to the glass slab and broke the ice wall.

Those images at the end used on the photographs mumbo shows - how were those scenes created? Does anyone know if they were played by a member of rare and "recorded" then implemented to the ending, or was it programmed? (The fact Wozza isn't there makes me think it was programmed).

They were done exactly like the demos were, as far as I know. Somebody acted out those videos by moving Banjo around as you would while playing, and the controller actions were recorded. That's how it's done usually, as far as I know. I've seen them glitch up on occasion, by the way. I once saw Banjo fall all the way to the bottom of the centre pillar of Sharkfood Island while on his way to the top. Naturally, he kept jumping and flip flapping, but seemingly randomly.

I'm not sure about the whole 64DD thing, but it'd make sense. The lock-on cartridge thing would probably work, unless there were some annoying RAM restricitions which would make it hard to do. It's been done before with Sonic & Knuckles...

If the actions were recorded - is it possible for mistakes like that to occur?

Also, if it is recorded so to speak, why is Wozza not there? Was the game played by the team in a debug mode...?

Yes, whenever there is lag, the game is still pushing the buttons, but the game didnt catch up to the pushing of the buttons, so it messes up.

You see, it's not recorded like a video, that would - obviously enough, take up bugger-loads of space. Instead, key-strokes are recorded. I'm not sure about Wozza, but Snacker was probably removed from the scene as he could probably appear at a random place in the sea, which might just cause Banjo to go off-course on his way to Sharkfood Island.

The wozza thing could be a clue...
Or maybe they just recorded the SnS stuff before finishing the level design

Or maybe they have a switch to turn Wozza and Snacker off, and then use that switch when playing the demos. I don't think recording the SnS stuff before finishing the level would have any effect on there being Snacker or Wozza there - it must read from something in the game already, and it would waste too much space to have a separate early level design in there.

In Treasure Trove Cove, were the crabs missing? And what about the snowmen in Freezey Peak?

We don't see enough of the levels to tell.

What I want to know is:
Since the pictures are just the buttons being pressed and not a movie (which thinking about it they had to be because there is a GS code to take control of Banjo). That means that what we are seeing is all in game. Is there an address in the memory that the pics access that refers to the real raising of Sharkfood Island or is it the same address as we already know.

I don't know if that made any sense at all but in my head it does :P

I think they removed Wozza from the ending demo, so he/she wouldn't talk and end up screwing the game text... Same thing with the shark...
When you are in her cave she talks ramdomly at some times, so what if she talks at the same time as mumbo? And why they removed Wozza and didn't remove the jinjo? they could have removed him too, since banjo avoids picking the jinjo up, for no reason at all.

Also, I dunno if this is old, did you guys see this interview?
http://www.n-sider.com/articleview.php?articleid=401
Is this fake?

uh-huh.

besides:
Q: So how would you get the four eggs you needed?
Anon: After completing certain tasks in Tooie, Blackeye the pirate would give you secret codes you could use in Banjo Kazooie to gain access to the eggs. Use them on the sandcastle floor just like cheat codes.

so the codes would most likely still need to be in kazooie. but subdrag/ice (forget which) said that there's no more codes in the table. besides, even if they were, why would rare program two sets of codes for each egg to do the same thing? either that or there would be no cutscenes for the raising of the island, opening of gobi's door, etc, which just seems lazy. highly uncharactaristic of rare.

I think that if any codes were to be given, it would be the "debug" SNS codes - after all you do get a small scene after each is entered...perhaos they were supposed to be used? And the reason "Cheat" is entered is because well - the SNS items do lead to certain "cheats" and hence "cheat" at the start of each code.

Perhaps.