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-   -   SNS update: I think I know which 4 of the 6 eggs we are supposed to get (https://www.therwp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1287)

Go_Nosis 8th December 2005 04:36 AM

true.. It would have to be something completely inobvious like that, too.. Otherwise Kazooie players might accidently stumble on it.

*goes to order a copy of tooie on the internet*

And chaotic Yoshi, I thought it'd be easier to cover ground with more than one experiment at a time :D

dmoss 9th December 2005 09:42 PM

*returns for a moment*

Hmm...I'm a bit lost concerning the seagulls thing. Could someone explain it to me in excrutiating details, please?

ChaoticTH 10th December 2005 12:42 AM

Honestly, I don't know where this seagull rumor came up from.

Want a good place to look for wierd stuff in BT? Try Hailfire peaks.

slaphappy 10th December 2005 02:13 AM

Excrutiating details? I don't think I'm up for that. I will give basic details though.

Go into Jolly's Tavern and play Shopping Around Town on the jukebox. Walk over to Blackeye and shoot a clockwork egg and detonate it behind him. You will now periodically hear the seagull sounds from the lighthouse area of TTC mixed in with the music.

Rare addressed it in one of their scribes, stating that the game developers were insulted that people called it a glitch. Well, it was along those lines. I'll dig it up tomorrow and post the actual question and response here for everyone that wasn't aware of it.

ChaoticTH 10th December 2005 08:28 AM

I see... I still say that Hailfire peaks could use a little investigation however...

I command a minion to do so!

Go_Nosis 10th December 2005 12:35 PM

Once I find a decent Tooie for sale via the net, Chaotic, I'll get to work on Hailfire Peaks. Any reason why you believe that stage should be checked out?

xtreme6789v2 10th December 2005 04:53 PM

Okay, I have been following along in these forums for a while... I have Banjo Kazooie and Tooie for N64 but the BK has gotten all the six eggs already. I did just try that "glitch" in Jolly Roger's Bar. From what I tested, it appears that turning on that song and firing a clockwork kazooie egg results in those seagulls and a new musical score to come in, as long as the clockwork piece lands on an object for a second. If you detonate it immediately, then it will not play. If you fire it in the air and detonate as it is falling, it will not activate the music either. Firing the egg for a second on a windowsill, the room next to the bar, the stools, the tables, the bar itself, the chests, his bed, etc. all result in the music playing, not just firing behind him. It seems to be a triggered event of sorts. Leaving the bar with an egg then returning will not work either, same with firing the egg before the music plays... Just so you know a little more about that.

slaphappy 10th December 2005 05:27 PM

Interesting finds xtreme. It definitely is triggered by a certain chain of events.

As for my prior posts, my mistake, it wasn't scribes, it was from Uncle Tusk. Either way...

Dear Uncle Tusk,
I'll get right to the point. I have two questions for you.
I own Banjo-Tooie and have completed most of the game except for the major mysteries. I'd like to know if there is a third race against Canary Mary like she mentioned. My only clues are the signs that read "She who mends carts can also fix mice."
My second question is this. I have found something that I am not sure of as to if it's a glitch or part of a secret. This is the "glitch". In Jolly's Bar, first you must play the "Shopping Around Town" track on the jukebox. Then, stand on the table in front of Captain Blackeye and launch a Clockwork Kazooie egg either behind Blackeye, behind the barrel to the right of him, or in front of the picture to the left of captain Blackeye (the picture of Shark Food Island viewed from outside). Then detonate the Clockwork egg in either of those locations. After this, the music will change slightly and you will hear seagulls and wind blowing, it sounds almost exactly as it did in Treasure Trove Cove in Banjo-Kazooie. I'd like to know if this is a glitch or part of a code? If it is part of a code, could I possibly get more hints about it?
Thanks,
Alex

Uncle Tusk replies: Right, let's get designertastic answers to both of these because, essentially, I can't be arsed with them. First up, the race:
"Once you've thrashed Mary at both handcart races in Glitter Gulch Mine, the feathered freak takes wing and swoops up into the clouds, threatening to bump into our duo again. Believe it or not, this is a thinly-veiled clue to the bird's later reappearance on Cloud Cuckooland (challenging B-K to an aerial race aboard a clockwork mouse), much later in the adventure. You obviously haven't quite reached such lofty heights yet."
And the jukebox: "'Glitch', sir? I am offended, as is the inconsolable programmer I've just shown this mail to. 'Tis no glitch, but one of the many tiny idiosyncrasies deliberately fashioned into the product just to demonstrate how much love and effort we poured into it. Honest."

Kratos_Aurion 10th December 2005 06:14 PM

Okay, something strange just happened. I entered the code to make the jukebox work (I entered it backwards, as I don't have the cheato pages), went to the jukebox, played a few other songs, began playing Shopping Around Town, stood in the doorway between the jukebox and Cap'n Blackeyes room, fired the egg, detonated it directly behind him (as close to him as I could get from behind), and the seagulls began playing. I proceeded to attack each of the treasure chests (A+B attack and Z+B attack, can't remember actual names, sorry), jumped at all of the pictures, and spoke to Blackeye several times. Then, I stood directly in front of the jukebox, and paused the game, and it froze, with a warped soundtrack playing. I'm not sure if this is a coincidence or not, but it just seemed strange...

ChaoticTH 11th December 2005 03:02 PM

it's not SnS related, I'll tell you THAT much.

And I say Hailfire peaks for Gobi and Boggy, 2 creatures that represent fire and ice, theres also the ice cubes, snowball, and many other suspicious stuff, also, I have a few more places that i have suspicion for.

Mayahem temple
Glitter gulch mine
Witchyworld(Only the outer region)
Jolly roger's lagoon(Done)
Grunty industries
Hailfire peaks
Cloud cuckoo land(Outer region)
Cauldron keep(Inner region)
SPIRAL MOUNTAIN

and I got BK from eBay, but I can't play it right now due to tech difficulties...

And no gameshark, so I won't get the items, I'll do anything that doesn't involve gameshark OR the eggs and key.

xtreme6789v2 11th December 2005 03:17 PM

Alright, just so you all know, I have an N64 with no gameshark and sadly all the SNS items known thus far (six eggs and key), but I will keep those items in case anyone wants to try out any theories regarding all six of them. Just contact me somehow, email, instant messaging, etc. if it is important, otherwise I will read it up in the forum. So far, I have noticed a good deal of theories on the site and we may want to find a better way of organizing things. Maybe separate threads for different theories? Not just proposing them, but actually trying to rule them out. Just a thought. Good luck everyone on SNS! Together, we can take down that evil company known as Rare and solve SNS!!! *laughing insanely*

ChaoticTH 11th December 2005 03:31 PM

...Honestly, what were they on when they deleted SnS?

Kratos_Aurion 11th December 2005 05:31 PM

Has anyone ever done the seagull thing with the jukebox with only the pink egg (meaning no other SNS items) in their inventory? Just a thought, but it may trigger something, with all of the hints toward it and the area it's in and such.

repobanjo 11th December 2005 06:52 PM

Well, we could do one thing that has been on the strange and controversial list for a long time. Backwards Masking. Someone could play one of the songs backwards, and the song might sound like something or someones voice we might need to talk to. Maybe the backwards playing would help us remmeber something from BK thats crucial to SNS, such as making sounds from the Tiptup Choir, or having it sound like the Furnace 'O Fun.

Hey, it worked for Doom 2, why not BT?

qwertybub3 11th December 2005 10:49 PM

worked for Doom 2?

dmoss 12th December 2005 02:48 AM

*back again...only for a moment*

Wow, reapo! Your mind works on another level...that is a great idea. Seriously! You never know what we could hear...Also, I think the "Only-get-the-pink-egg-trick" might have something to it, Kratos! I'm so proud...

*wipes away tear; walks away slowly*

GameandWatch33 12th December 2005 02:51 AM

It appears that I have missed a lot. I am sorry that I could not come around for a week or two. Between work and school, I was swamped.

But, I am back and free for a while.

ChaoticTH 12th December 2005 03:39 AM

welcome back gameandwatch!

and music backwards theory?

We're gonna need a elite squadron for that...

qwertybub3 12th December 2005 12:44 PM

I will try to play one of the songs backwards. But what does "
Hey, it worked for Doom 2, why not BT?"

repobanjo 12th December 2005 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaoticYoshi
welcome back gameandwatch!

and music backwards theory?

We're gonna need a elite squadron for that...

...Or a simple machine that we can buy somewhere. I'm strapped for cash, but maybe there is a site where you can take the music to it and it will play backwards. Does this site have mp3s of the jukebox music?

Oh, and thanks, dmoss. I don't think I deserve a compliment for that, though

And for Doom 2, in the final boss, he speaks in what sounds like garbles, satanic messages. In reality, if you play it bacwards, it says, "In order to win the game, you must kiil me, Johnny Ramero." Tis gives you a hint that there is a Johnny Ramero head stuck on a pike somewhere, and destroying that automatically kill the boss.

hatrickpatrick 12th December 2005 08:02 PM

I'm sure we can play an mp3 backwards by loading it into fruity loops, it has all kinds of stuff like that...

repobanjo 12th December 2005 08:18 PM

Well, I have never heard of fruity loops. The way I play sogs backwards is with a special machine I have on my LP record playr that reverses the revolutions. Of course, that restricts the songs I can play backwards, and Banjo songs are one of those restricted.

xtreme6789v2 12th December 2005 08:54 PM

Well, can you upload the songs to your computer? It should be easy enough to do with just taking the audio cable and outting that to your computer. I recommend a program like Goldwave (free, trial version, just naggin screens, will always work for you) and you can record the songs and then play them in reverse as well. Really nice program. It can do many other editing things as well, so feel free to putz with it (who knows, twice as fast, twice as slow? it might reveal something...). Good luck!

qwertybub3 12th December 2005 10:26 PM

What song should I try?

repobanjo 12th December 2005 10:44 PM

How about, "Shopping around Town". It's the one with the seagulls, y'know. It's really the most suspicous. If possible, since I do not have the technology currently, can you post an mp3 of your results for all of us to hear? That way, all of us can pool our banjo trivia tigether for ultimate impact. If you do this, and this theory actually works (fat chance though), you will be rewarded for proving it. Along with whoever discovers the hidden thing in the song, qwertybub and hatrickpatrick, everyone on this board should be credited for this. If it wasn't for you guys, I would have never gotten the inspiration to think of this theory. Really though, these thanks won't help. This will never work.

qwertybub3 12th December 2005 10:50 PM

How do I do the seagull thing?

banjokatooie 12th December 2005 11:18 PM

phew!
just finished reading all 69 pages...


i'm pretty new here, but ive bin watchin this thread with interest...


i cant remember half of the theries already posted, but it sounds like u guys are definatley getting somewhere with this... well done!

im still unsure about the GBTG board, but you never know...
(this is Rare, after all)

ive been doing a bit of work myself, which has been limited, since i hav no idea how 2 hack... :(

but i DO have an N64, and what i believe 2 b a non-GS'd copy of BK.
(got it second hand, mite have had the eggs, then the reset code..)

i also have ROMs of both BK and BT, (also DK64 and CBFD, if it helps)
along with PJ64 v1.6

bk is 100% complete on the 1st save, but alas not the other 2..

from the little work i hav done though, i have checked the X (1881) barrel, and using wireframe in PJ64, u can see that the geometry is not active without the cheat. wich i think condradicts wot was said b4 about being able to clip it & walk around inside there... not sure

ive also been able to verify that the whole of sharkfood island is always loaded, but a huge chunk of it is normally hidden below the sandline, along with the door.

(wots this glitch were u can swim and then surface and it warps u inside?)

not sure about the cluckers, (CCW birds) cant see a conection, but definatley weird, all the same...

the music theorie (sp.) seems a little far-fetched, but like i said, u never know until u try...

sorry for such i long post, but ive had a few things 2 say, n had 2 w8 4 my account to activate... :(

all in all, well done and good luck,
we may find SNS , if not, it'll b fun trying...

repobanjo 12th December 2005 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slaphappy
Excrutiating details? I don't think I'm up for that. I will give basic details though.

Go into Jolly's Tavern and play Shopping Around Town on the jukebox. Walk over to Blackeye and shoot a clockwork egg and detonate it behind him. You will now periodically hear the seagull sounds from the lighthouse area of TTC mixed in with the music.

Rare addressed it in one of their scribes, stating that the game developers were insulted that people called it a glitch. Well, it was along those lines. I'll dig it up tomorrow and post the actual question and response here for everyone that wasn't aware of it.


Here it is, qwerty. Although, maybe you don't need the seagulls for this to work.

Welcome to the boards, banjokatooie. You seem like a hacker, but your downfall is abbreveating words with numbers. Please don't do this on that site. Otherwise, you are a good member that has hacking skills.

xtreme6789v2 13th December 2005 02:54 AM

Well for one, it is highly unlikely to obtain hidden messages unless they are on a really low frequency, thusly hard to hear since the garbled reverse sounds would be obvious in songs (unless slowed down extremely). Also, they could only be found maybe playing them loud, so whoever plays with these will have to be very careful in searching the different ways of manipulating sound files. I could try playing with them if someone gets them too. Good luck everyone!

Icy Guy 13th December 2005 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by repobanjo
And for Doom 2, in the final boss, he speaks in what sounds like garbles, satanic messages. In reality, if you play it bacwards, it says, "In order to win the game, you must kiil me, Johnny Ramero." Tis gives you a hint that there is a Johnny Ramero head stuck on a pike somewhere, and destroying that automatically kill the boss.

You mean John Romero? (I wish I had a link to that Wiki article that said a sprite of Romero's head was inside the wall, or something.)

hatrick is right: you can use FruityLoops (now called FL Studio; it's music production software) to reverse an MP3 file. However, I doubt you guys will find anything in the music, because, due to the limited capacity of N64 carts, they probably wouldn't have enough memory to fit a hidden message in. But you're welcome to try.

xtreme6789v2 13th December 2005 05:18 AM

Why would a hidden message matter? It would just be a set of 1's and 0's of music either way to the computer inside the N64. It would not be any different than background music they have normally. Maybe that is where it is hidden. In my opinion, it is a broad topic and would be hard to find, but still a good idea, and I my best wishes to those wishing to pursue it!

Icy Guy 16th December 2005 03:25 AM

Exactly. It would have to be stored in space that could be better used for, say, textures, instrument samples, models, and art.

You seem to be under the impression that N64 carts were capable of holding large amounts of streamed music (most N64 music is sequenced/tracked/MIDI) and that cartridges don't have smaller capacities than CDs (the three largest N64 games were 512 Mb carts; PS1 discs held 512 MB). The reason people can put these subliminal messages in "real" songs is because the only restriction they have is the song's running time, not whether or not X WAV file will fit within the game's space limitations.

xtreme6789v2 16th December 2005 04:06 AM

Alrighty, I tested one of the theories, also known as the Croc theory from BGS... I looked around the level and tried redoing the crocs (has to be on a new file, since they disappear), and I was not able to find anything significant about them or the level on either a new or completed game. The order they appeared when I tested it was first Green, then Blue, then Red, then Light Blue, and lastly Magenta. It did not contain the other color of Yellow. I had paused and turned to the Stop N' Swop menu at each Croc to see if that would result in anything and I compared the colors simulataneously. They did match up, but the result was just the regular, old jiggy. Hopefully this is one less theory to scratch off our list!

qwertybub3 16th December 2005 06:54 PM

Your not going to like this but http://savefile.com/files/1101565

repobanjo 16th December 2005 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icy Guy
Exactly. It would have to be stored in space that could be better used for, say, textures, instrument samples, models, and art.

You seem to be under the impression that N64 carts were capable of holding large amounts of streamed music (most N64 music is sequenced/tracked/MIDI) and that cartridges don't have smaller capacities than CDs (the three largest N64 games were 512 Mb carts; PS1 discs held 512 MB). The reason people can put these subliminal messages in "real" songs is because the only restriction they have is the song's running time, not whether or not X WAV file will fit within the game's space limitations.


I see...well, this can really blow this out of the water. Though there could be something else.

Maybe they puposefuly made a certain sound in the BGM sound like that so if played backwards, it would souns like something farmilliar. That is very unlikley, though.

The more and more I look at my theory, the less and less it makes sence. I don't think we need to bother trying anymore.

Yes, I ment Romero I forgot his name for a while. I can get the pic of his severed head if y'all want to see it.

hatrickpatrick 16th December 2005 08:03 PM

Was I the only one who was very faintly reminded of the SnS music during the first half of the backwards file? It's also kind of like the captains cabin in RBB and Gnawty's house in CCW...

repobanjo 16th December 2005 08:10 PM

What backwards file? Either I have not been here long enough to know about this, or I was, and I just had a pang of amnesia.

If you were reminded of the SnS music, maybe this could actually be true. Maybe the room with the backwards SnS music is the room where there is/was a SnS connection.

This is really stretching it, but it reminds you of the captains cabin and Gnawty's house, right? Well, maybe since it's that backwards, it symbolises that it's fake. So, if this (idd and probably false) assumption is true, the four eggs are:

Pink
Blue
Cyan
Green

Yes, both of the MMM eggs. Don't forget the Ice Key!

edit: nevermind, I understand the backwards file. I'm surprised they sound alike forwards and backwards. Yes, I do connect with SnS on that. A watery, bubbly, fanfare. Pink egg, anyone?

I was actually half-excpecting it to say something liike an angry Rare employee yelling, "Stop your frickin' SnS searching! You know it's gone, so why bother?"

qwertybub3 16th December 2005 08:32 PM

The backwards file that I posted here http://savefile.com/files/1101565

Upsilon 16th December 2005 08:52 PM

I can't help but be sceptical about this backwards masking. I've tried it with a couple of MIDIs and while the result is weird and fascinating, I can't see it helping in the quest for SnS.

qwertybub3 16th December 2005 09:02 PM

captains cabin and Wicthy World music sound the same.


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