Nintendo is really ahead of Sega.

[Rock]

Recently I started playing both New Super Mario Bros Wii and Sonic 4. They have similar release dates, not identical but they're quite close together. And I realized something I never realized before.

Nintendo really understand the market so much better than Sega.

Nintendo have constantly updated and improved the Mario franchise. They have almost perfect formulas when it comes to improving the 2D Super Mario Bros (what a great way they brought it back in New Super Mario Bros for DS and then Wii, with the updated 3D graphics and additions everything) and Super Mario 64 (where Super Mario Galaxy series has kept it really fresh and modern, yet keeping to traditional values.

Contrastingly, Sega was failing with Sonic 3D games - they were heavily criticized for their games which took the IP of Sonic and made second-rate 3D games that weren't fun like the originals (in the opinion of many people, not everybody of course, I liked a few of them).

What I realized was that, while Nintendo are storming ahead improving Mario, and updating it so that everybody still likes the old formula, Sega arguably got it so wrong that they actually had to go all the way back to the original games. Sonic 4 is not new in any way. There is a lot of innovative stuff but the graphics are very retro and they basically went back to the basics rather than actually improved anything much.

So, what do you think? Was it obvious, and was I just behind in my realization? Do you agree/disagree with my accusation? And what do you think of the new Sonic games vs the new Mario games and Sonic 4?

[Adam]

The sky is also blue, Larry. I mean, this was made obvious when Sega stopped making consoles altogether. This was made obvious when Sonic had huge backlash while Mario was getting critical acclaim and much, sometimes unwarranted, praise. This was made obvious when in a last ditch effort, Sega decided to get rid of much if not all of the fresh ideas they've tried with Sonic and made Sonic 4. This had been obvious since Sonic Adventure 2, Larry.

Also, how does NSMBWii have a similar release date to Sonic 4?

[4320p]

Hi, I'm from 1999 and this is news to me.

[Rock]

thanks L33T, would say more but I'll respond later if some other people post.

Originally Posted by 3V1L L33T

How does NSMBWii have a similar release date to Sonic 4?

Well, similar release time. A year difference...like, not 5 years apart or anything. Around the same time in the same generation with a similar purpose. They're both bringing back an old franchise but Mario also updates it and makes it so accessible to people who have never seen a 2D platformer before AND people who have. My 6 year old nephew absolutely loves NSMB, but would probably hate Sonic 4, just because NSMB is more appealing. And yet probably people who loved old Mario and old Sonic would love both. Nintendo's good at updating Mario while keeping the overall experience the same, something Sega seems bad at (which imo is why they had to go all the way back to the beginning with Sonic 4). But who knows what the future may hold.

[Zeek]

I'd think the reason Sonic games have been failing is Sega's lack of bug testing, really. If Sonic didn't fly out of areas or get stuck in spots or fail to go through scripted loops properly, the games might be a lot better.

[Solid Snix]

It was obvious, but it's still quite a shame. Just today I went through Sonic 3 & Knuckles, and good god! That game is one of the best platformers I've played in my life. Sega nailed everything! The music, the graphics, hell, even story IN-GAME! Half-way though, once you get all the chaos emeralds, you start to discover remnants of Knuckles ancestors, returning to the sanctuary every time you get a Super Emerald. The music for these remnants is really nice too. It's just soo... epic... so comforting. Towards the end, you can see the Death Egg being rebuilt, and then you watch as it turns a snowy mountain into a volcanic hell. In the fight with Knuckles, you see pictures in the background that foreshadow the final battle. At the end of said battle, Robotnik betrays Knuckles and takes the Master Emerald, causing Knuckles to see the truth and help Sonic and Tails out any way he can despite being weak. Playing though this game in its entirety felt like playing SA1 & SA2/SA2B for the very first time. Actually, scratch that. It BEAT playing through the Sonics Adventure games for the very first time. People aren't kidding when they say this is the best of the series. Hell, I'd call it a 16-bit masterpiece. I really hope Sonic 4 can live up to this epic adventure in the long run.

[Seanadelic]

I don't think it matters what Sega does with Sonic anymore either way it's just not going to be the same.

I think they at least should hold back on the number of game titles, like seriously Sonic 4 just came out, we're expecting Sonic Colours, Sonic Free Riders and another un-named game. It's not as if they have no other good ideas or franchises that haven't had games in a few years, because they do but for some reason pumping out Sonic games seems to be priority 1.

Granted i haven't played the new game, but i think it probably turned out better than Unleashed.

[Aaron Anderson]

Sega seem to be back on track full steam ahead though.

[Alice]

Sega's fanbase certainly don't help though.

[Starblazer]

Kind of obvious don't ya think? Clearly Nintendo's the better developer. They won the Saturn vs. N64 battle, the SNES vs. Genesis battle and the GC vs. Dreamcast. Game wise, Mario's beat Sonic's by a mile.

[BKGeno4Ever]

Orly?
But yeah, Nintendo listens to fans. Look at all the games coming out.

[Starblazer]

True, Nintendo really DOES listen to fans. Sonic and Snake got into Brawl, didn't they?

[BKGeno4Ever]

DKC returns... 'Nuff said.

[Starblazer]

Yeah. That too.

[Alice]

Sega certainly listen to their fans, as of late. When Sonic 4 Episode One was leaked, a lot of the fans raged about Act Two of the casino zone, and Act Two of Lost Labyrynth. Those levels had been completely changed to suit fans. But then you have the other half of the fanbase, who rage over things like Sonic having green eyes. Sega often tries too hard to please both halves, and also to incorporate new ideas into Sonic games.

Nintendo seems to have a lot less dificulty in pleasing fans, and creating good games.