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  #16  
Old 3rd October 2022, 08:49 PM
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Donkey Kong 64 is best
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  #17  
Old 4th October 2022, 01:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qwertyo76 View Post
Tooie is flawed
Great, we agree
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  #18  
Old 4th October 2022, 05:59 AM
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Or to paraphrase the wise words of the forefathers: I think Banjo Tooie is probably an okay game, it's just not a good Banjo game.
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  #19  
Old 4th October 2022, 06:12 AM
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Anyway goldeneye is fine
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  #20  
Old 4th October 2022, 06:12 AM
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Sorry for double posting
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  #21  
Old 4th October 2022, 07:31 PM
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  #22  
Old 4th October 2022, 09:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qwertyo76 View Post
Your gameplay standards are bad, mayhaps. Tooie is flawed for sure and I will readily admit ways that it is, but saying it's a bad game overall is a bit rich. 80% of Tooie complaints are just impatient whining from folks who can't enjoy something without turning their brain off entirely. The other 20% of complaints are valid but even those legitimate issues with BT are largely minor
Flawed, nothing! The game's only real problem is that the framerate is crap on N64. The rest of its alleged flaws (like the BaCkTrAcKiNg) are good, ambitious ideas that people failed to appreciate. And no other platformer ever built on and polished those ideas, like Banjo-Kazooie built on Mario 64, so Tooie is stuck forever as that weird outlier that no one quite knows how to play instead of the modern blueprint for sandbox platformers, like it should've been.

Banjo-Tooie and Diddy's Kong Quest (not in that order) are the two greatest games Rare ever made.
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  #23  
Old 4th October 2022, 10:55 PM
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My take on backtracking is that it was a good idea/system handled somewhat poorly. I didn't used to think it was handled poorly but nowadays I really have to admit a lot of the backtracking sucked and was dumb.

I will defend the CONCEPT of backtracking to death and I do think people are waaay too complainy about it, but I also REALLY think they could've handled it better a lot of the time......
I was about to make a list of backtracking Jiggies that bother me but it's easier to summarize: I dislike the Jiggies that are literally just padding. The Glide Jiggy on the pillar in Jolly Roger's Lagoon for example isn't a challenge, it isn't creative, it isn't interesting in ANY way, it's just
  • fumble around in vain trying to get it
  • eventually give up
  • return waaaay later once you have learned glide
  • glide to it

This is stupid, this is JUST padding that exists solely to waste the player's time for no good reason. I didn't learn anything, I didn't achieve anything, I didn't have fun, I didn't apply my knowledge cleverly, I didn't execute a task that was difficult, nothing about this sequence of events was worth my time and energy. It's ARBITRARY that this Jiggy was unobtainable until later, and there are a LOT of Jiggies like this. They drag down Tooie a lot, making it feel like a list of chores. The backtracking I do actually love is when there is justification for it as it's trying to do something actually interesting, clever, or worthwhile.

A couple ways to improve this particular Jiggy and not make it dumb and stupid and lame and also dumb
  • have a possible, but difficult way to obtain it on the first visit, and glide is just a late game way to get it more easily
  • have a minor platforming challenge involved here that requires kazooie to glide from crevice to crevice correctly, and requires a slight amount of thought/effort to make it across. having gusts of wind you have to navigate around is another idea, just have it be SOMETHING
  • move this jiggy to hailfire peaks, where it isn't necessary for it to be difficult, as it would now serve as a reward for getting through the Icicle Grotto and as a very basic showcase on how to glide
  • keep the Jiggy in JRL unchanged, but add a shortcut from the Icicle Grotto to Smuggler's Cavern so that you don't waste the player's time
  • keep this sequence of events unchanged, but swop the Jiggy for something else like a Cheato Page

If you're gonna make me backtrack you better justify it SOMEhow. Figuring out how to smuggle food out of Witchyworld to feed the cavemen was a somewhat fun way of doing backtracking. Crossing the Stomping Plains with Banjo solo is neat to figure out, even if it's easy once you know how. Just......something, please. Don't force players to come back arbitrarily.
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  #24  
Old 4th October 2022, 11:32 PM
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Oddjob is shorter than everyone else in Goldeneye, kinda unfair tbh
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  #25  
Old 5th October 2022, 01:45 AM
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Jinjo is the Oddjob of Banjo-Tooie.

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  #26  
Old 5th October 2022, 02:09 AM
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Banjo-Tooie is a fine game..

..but it's not as good as Super Mario Sunshine.
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  #27  
Old 5th October 2022, 04:55 AM
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  #28  
Old 5th October 2022, 06:12 AM
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ain't i a stinker
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  #29  
Old 6th October 2022, 01:18 AM
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I think Bubsy 3D is a good platformer.
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